Genevieve Dozier: Fashion to Banking

Season 2 Episode 6: Genevieve had dreams of working in fashion before finding herself in financial services.  Now she's Product leader, speaker, coach and is writing a book!

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Transcript

0:00

Welcome to the Unexpected Career Podcast, where we share stories of real people and the twists and turns they have taken along their career journey. I am Megan Dunford, and as someone who found myself in the payments industry, largely by accident, I'm fascinated by how people's careers unfold and how they've gotten to where they are today. It's also why I'm passionate about reducing the pressure on young people, about going to university, what to take in school, and on getting that right first job. My guest today is Genevieve Dozier, who was faced with a decision between fashion and banking at the start of her career.

Megan: 0:41

Hello. Hey, how are you? How are you? Good, thank you. First of all, thank you for joining and agreeing to participate and be a guest. I really appreciate it. And yeah, I always start right from the beginning of, when you think back to when you were a child is, what did you wanna be when you grew up? Was there one thing that you thought you wanted to be when you grew up?

Genevieve: 1:09

Yeah. It's funny. So I'll go way back. To elementary school. I feel like those were those dreams, every grade. Right. They were like, what do you wanna be when you grow up? And mine was mostly influenced by movies that I had seen. Mm-hmm. When I think back to it, I. Saw Jurassic Park, and then I was like, oh, maybe I wanna be an archeologist. Right? Yeah. And dig up dinosaur bones. Or I saw a movie, right? With astronauts. I was like, oh, that'd be really cool to be an astronaut. But these were, real thoughts that entered my head as a child. And then I. For some reason in third grade, I did a whole project on me becoming the first female president of the United States of America. Amazing. That was a very short lived dream. I'm not sure. It was a great vision, right? A great vision board. I had a whole poster board with me up there with my American flag, but very short-lived aspiration and and so as I, actually got. Later in high school. And the reality of it set in, of what are you gonna do? What college are you gonna go to? You know why? And so I. I remember sitting with my friend it's funny, I recently, I'm working on a book, so I recently wrote part of this in my books. I'm sitting there with my best friend at the lunch table in high school and we're like, God, why are they forcing us to choose right now? Yeah. When you're 17, 16. And it was like, do you wanna be a nurse? Do you wanna be a teacher? I feel like it was kind of these, I don't know, boxing you in it felt like mm-hmm. I had recently started drawing and I was mostly drawing like dresses and clothes on, the figures. And I had recently started sewing as well. My grandmother was actually an artist, and so I think I drew inspiration from her paintings that hung on our wall. And she had and she was of course older at the time, but she was still painting. She actually went a long time not painting, and then started painting again. And so drew some inspiration from that and was like, maybe fashion design is something. I'm, I was sewing, right? I was drawing these designs. And so that's what I ended up being like, let, maybe let's pursue this. And so I looked at a college that was nearby about three hours from my hometown and they had a great fashion design program. And that was really part of going there. But I also chose to go there. Because it was smaller smaller campus, smaller classes. I was from a really small town, so going to these big huge class sizes kind of scared me, or just a big campus scared me. Yeah. It would

Megan: 3:35

be overwhelming.

Genevieve: 3:36

Yeah, for sure. And so when I went there on campus, it was just this gorgeous campus. It felt like it was a little, and it was in a big city, but it felt like a little like a dome was over top of it. And it was shielded from the city and because so much greenery. And it wasn't all women's college and Oh wow. I actually really loved that. And it's funny because back then I wasn't into empowering women like I have been for the last, I'd say, 10 or so years of my career intentionally. And I remember saying I'm not a feminist, but I. I didn't at that point really understand what a feminist was. It was more of a, I just looked at that as like a protestor, right? Yeah. Burn the brass from what seen in like history. But I liked that more so from, there's no distractions, right? It's just where it's all girls. We could go to our class in our pajamas, not have to. Put makeup on. And I did have a high school boyfriend at the time. And so I thought that was a good thing since he was at home still so going back to what I wanna be with that was my evolution of what I wanted to be when I grew up.

Megan: 4:35

That's amazing. And I love how, when you were picking which college to go to the course was a big part of it. It had a really, good program for what you were looking to take, but also all those other aspects that went into that decision, and really thinking holistically of what you wanted from the college experience. I think that's really cool. Yeah. So you took fashion design in college. So what happened when you graduated? Did you pursue fashion or what was your first job outta school?

Genevieve: 5:08

Yeah. No I loved it and it was a great space for me because I didn't really have a big group of friends in high school. I just didn't, feel like I, I didn't play sports, right? So I was more of a more of a academia. And I, I did yearbook. I was on our newspaper I wrote for our newspaper. So I was of more of that girl in high school. Yeah. I was like on the math competition team, which sounds really nerdy, but I think when I got into these fashion design classes, I fell into a group of people that was more like-minded to myself. And that felt really good. Right. To be able to surround yourself with people that are similar yet different, and just again, that feeling of belongingness. And it was interesting because something had translated to me from my fashion professor when we were talking through the fashion cycle as far as people. And how you have some people that create the trend, right? Yeah. And you have others that are fast followers, and then you have, so they're a little bit ahead of the trend, but they didn't create it, right? Mm-hmm. And then you have those that are just. On trend, those that are a little bit behind of it. And those that don't even care what the trend is, they just wear whatever they want. Yeah. And so I kinda learned in her teaching us that I was I wasn't creating the trend, but I was a little bit ahead of it, just in my own style and what I was choosing to wear or even, making some of my own clothes. But in high school, that was detrimental to me in. Society, right. In your high school society, because it was like, oh my gosh, why are you wearing these platform boots? Or, whatever it is. I got teased and picked on. You don't

Megan: 6:44

wanna stand out in high school

Genevieve: 6:47

wearing it. And I was like, what? Like, yeah. So it did make me feel better once I got to college and understood the why, right? Yeah. I loved fashion again I loved it. I loved all the classes and I had to take almost as many business classes as fashion as part of the major. Mm-hmm. And so that's where honestly, I had this great fashion professor that was a mentor to me. And then I had a great business professor who was a mentor to me, and he suggested Hey. You're already taking all these business classes anyway, go ahead and double major. And so I filled the rest of my electives with business courses. So I graduated in four years with a Bachelor's of science, but it was a double major in fashion design and business administration management. Wow. Fashion design, merchandising, concentration. So I did more on the merchandising side than design. I even, I spent a summer abroad in Europe and lived in Paris and Wow. Traveled to Belgium and Italy. I was like, in it, I love Fashion Week. I was behind in some of the runway shows, like helping the models get dressed and, putting their shoes on and that, that was my dream. That's amazing. I was like, if I didn't actually have a design house myself, I wanted to work for one, but actually do fashion show production or the merchandising of the store. Or work at the design house and do couture. Right. So that was what I loved and wanted to do. To your question. So I mentioned my high school boyfriend. He actually moved to where I went to college at, and he already was in his career. Because he was a few years older. And so we made the joint decision that unfortunately to pursue fashion, we would've had to move. And we didn't wanna do that. I also recognized in, being in that fashion industry, it's, you're on almost 24, hours a day. And it didn't really lend itself to a family. And that was definitely something I wanted to do, was to have kids and not have to work all days, all hours of the day. And so I started looking at more. Business opportunities than fashion, and my business professor suggested that I interview on campus. So there was a bank that was coming on campus to interview and they specifically were hiring college grads for this. Leadership program where you come in all college graduates, whether it was bachelor's or master's, you do the six month on the job training where you learn all aspects of the bank and then at the end of it, they they placed you in a specific line of business. And I was like, this is crazy. I don't wanna work for a bank. The only thing I knew about a bank at the time was I thought the teller was the only job. Right. That's the only thing I had ever seen. but I still interviewed and then I learned more about the bank and there are more jobs at the bank than just the teller. And it was, at the time it was a good salary coming right out of college. Good benefits. It was the location I wanted to be in. It was that nine to five And so I pursued. That opportunity. And it was a long interview process. Several months actually. Oh, wow. Having to travel for these. But again, it was this kind of str prestigious leadership program, and they were accepting, college students from all over the country into the program. So it was pretty competitive. And so I stayed with it though, interviewed, and then I got that job offer and accepted it before I graduated. Oh, wow. And my fashion professor, she actually was like kind of mad at me. She, that I didn't go the fashion route. So that was hard. But that was my first job right out of college. Yeah.

Megan: 10:14

So pivoted from fashion to. Banking. But you mentioned why there was a lot of thought that went into that process of not just what kind of job do you want, but what kind of life you wanted to build. I think that's, an important part of any decision making process. So you started out in banking. Is banking something you stuck with? Are you still in the banking world? What's that journey been like? I.

Genevieve: 10:41

Yeah, so it's been, it will have been 20 years next year, which is crazy I graduated June of 2006 from college and so when I right, went into the bank after that leadership program I mentioned I specifically went into a division called Merchant Services and I actually chose it'cause it sounded like fashion merchandising. Is a little bit different. So, it's the division of the bank that enables businesses to accept cards for payment. Mm-hmm. And I did research that as well as checking the boxes that it sounded like fashion merchandising. And, I thought, oh, helping people, be able to pay by card or, business to be able to accept cards. I felt like that was job security like. I didn't feel cards are going anywhere. If not, they're just gonna be more prevalent in the market. And so that's why I chose that division. To answer your question, short poll is yes I've stayed in that merchant services. Industry. I have gone to work for other companies that are, what I say, part of the transaction process. I always joke like, when you tap your card or swipe it or dip at all the things that happen in those few seconds where you get your receipt it's insane the amount of, touch points it has where it's getting that approval or decline and where it pulls the money from and sends the money to. That's all I say. It's all invisible. Right. Yeah. And so whether it's and I did do a few other roles at the bank that was more on the issuing side, but mm-hmm. But always, I've always been in the business of cards, whether it was paying with your card or accepting a card. I have stayed in that for my entire career. Yeah.

Megan: 12:22

Amazing. So you started in this grad program and you stayed in cards throughout your career journey. How did you make decisions along the way in terms of if it was a decision to, change companies or change roles what were the things that went into some of those decisions along your journey?

Genevieve: 12:44

Yeah. No, and you could sit here and go pinpoint right? Each move, and to your point I know I have been thoughtful with each one, and there wasn't, any haste decisions. I think an overarching theme has been trusting myself and, my kind of gut instincts. I think I lean on my faith a lot and. Just not, and not necessarily faith tied to religion necessarily, but more faith from the. From the point of view of having a knowledge in your heart, right? And it's like your mind. And I do this even with my daughter now, she's trying to make a big decision. It's like we can map out pros and cons, right? But then at the end of the day, like you have to look, inside yourself and know is this the right decision? And then just go with it. And I think an overarching theme has also been, for me, a learning of different career moves has been that, you make the best decision at the time with what information you have. Yeah. And to give yourself grace, right? If things don't necessarily turn out at some point, the way you had hoped or intended or expected, and that it's more so what you learn. On that journey or during that kind of pivot. And then I've been focused on then, for each kind of career move, who have I helped? So hopefully I've helped people, along the way,'cause that's a core, core value of mine. Started out more helping businesses, right? And then it I've focused and more on the people part of that business. And then ultimately. The latter part of my career has been more of what's the legacy that I'm gonna leave behind and how does this role fit into that? I had started my own company a little over two years ago and for several reasons, it was more so trying to get that sense of freedom. I. Not necessarily have to work for another company, but could I do something on my own? So I'm working for myself. And I've been excited about that as well. And doing it alongside my full time role because it's just, it's not at a point where it could, suffice the the full-time revenue that I need. Yeah. You know, for everything. And that's where. In an entrepreneurial journey versus a corporate journey. I've been playing with this metaphor, or not playing with it, but more, focusing on it is a better term of, balancing. It's like work-life balance was kinda early in the career. And then again, I think it's different, the entrepreneurial versus corporate journey of balancing like your dreams. Versus having money versus responsibilities. Because it's not just me. It's my kids now that are 12 and 14 and potentially thinking about college soon or, gonna need a car soon. And so it's if it was just me, I potentially could take more risk right in my career journey. But I'm choosing not to, right now because I feel this responsibility to them. So I think it's just always keeping everything in mind and I think I, I didn't realize it as much, but I think it did. I, or even early in my career, I did make career move decisions based on my mental health. I just don't think I consciously knew that's what I was doing. Yeah. But I think it's, that you feel physically safe in a workplace like psychologically safe, right? You like what you do, you like who you work with, you like who you work for. And focusing on those things. And then if that's not there, trying to figure out, right? Can you work with that? Or is it time to make a move internally? Or at what point is it time to make a move externally? Or then, do you try to start your own company? Right? So I think it's all things that. Again, over 20 years. Those have been some of my thought processes. And then like I said, I think for each individual move you could get a little bit more detailed with specific, obstacles that were being faced that kind of helped fuel those decisions.

Megan: 16:37

Yeah, I think you touched on so many really important points of, one of them is just the definition of what balances changes throughout your life and your circumstances and what's important at that time. And that's always an evolving thing. So I just, I love how you touched on that. And then the other thing is that you make the best decisions you can with the information you have today and. That's ultimately the best any of us can do. And it's okay if it's the wrong decision, if you are learning from something and then you can make a new decision and, you just keep evolving because you never gonna have all the information before. Some of those things you touched about, like from a culture standpoint, if you're going into a new company, you do the best you can to find out those culture pieces, but you don't know till you're there or. Even your example back from high school when they're talking about what careers, we don't know all the jobs out there, so we have to start with something and then see, or even your example of picking merchant services.'cause it sounded a bit like merchandising. That's as good of, a reason as any really to pick that first job.'cause you don't know what any job really is like. there's so much good. Insight that you shared there. And I love that. Are you happy to talk a little bit about what you're doing today? And then you also said you're like working on a book and you've got this, company that you started do you mind talking about that a little bit more and how you are finding some of that. Balance and getting your dreams in there while making sure you still have a paycheck at the same time.

Genevieve: 18:15

Yeah, it's been a lot and it's been a lot of it, I'm calling it mental gymnastics. And I think the biggest thing is for me to just be aware of my. Mental state and be open. And even, you know, I think I cried a little bit yesterday morning, but it was helpful. Like it was, because you have to get that out. I even I do that with my kids, even if they're, they're like, oh, I don't wanna go to school today. And they start like getting really frustrated, but it's really something deeper, right? That's bothering them. And then we talk through it and they feel better. So I think being really aware of my mental state and. Prioritizing my task has been really helpful for me to juggle it all. Yeah. And in choosing right when I am prioritizing what, and make sure I am leaving space, and it does sound like a lot, but leaving space for. Just me and my daughter, just me and my son, just me and my husband, just me alone, just me and my friends, right? Just me and my we take care of my father-in-law as well. He my mother-in-law passed really suddenly two years ago. And so we had to take on a caregiver role for him. He didn't, he never used a card before. He only uses cash. He had never used the washer dryer before. He d certainly doesn't even know how to use a computer. Right. It's that, the different generation. And so we've taken over a lot taking on him. And so that's been another, another level that I think a lot of people in the career, world don't talk about, they talk about mm-hmm. Having kids, but not taking care of parents in and at the same time Yeah.

Megan: 19:41

That I think they call it the sandwich generation. Yes.

Genevieve: 19:45

Yeah. So I think more people should talk about that, um, for sure. Because it was like, I, out nowhere. I was like, how do people deal with that? And when they're not in a facility, right? Because he, his health is okay and he wants to keep living, at his house. Like he is about 15 minutes away, so it's not not too far, but it is a lot extra on our plate. So yeah, so I was trying to do just my own company. It's very hard out there and some people, I think maybe it comes me easier than others. But, going from a job where you're just. Pay to do something versus then having to find people to pay you to do something Yeah. Is very different. And trying to create this unique value prop in the market of like, why me? Right? Why, why pay me? And so I started that consulting, one-on-one coaching, training speaking. And again, for about two years I didn't have any paid customers. I had done a lot of proposals or a lot of people were, Hey, send me some customers and we'll give you a referral share. Mm-hmm. I didn't, I really wasn't too interested in that model. And so between those two years I did go back to work to corporate. And then I took a step back last year. I had to have a surgery, my first surgery ever. It was a hysterectomy and so I took some time off to focus on me, and it was actually, it was a great time because it's like, yeah, the surgery was a little bit scary, but it wasn't that bad. I think it was. Again, talking about it with other women. I actually opened up on LinkedIn about it and I got an overwhelming response. Like people said, thank you so much for talking about this. And so many people replied to me saying you know, I've also had that happen. so it was a lot of comradery and I was like, oh my gosh, this is amazing. Right? Again, things we should talk about. And, but I had a great time recovering because I was just, again, focused on me. I was spending time with my kids. It was during the summer. And so I made that conscious decision to not go back to work, to try to, invest in me again. Yeah, and I did, I did have two, two paid customers I was really excited about, and one actually came where. They contacted me for one thing, but then I pitched me for something else and they were like, yeah, that sounds great. And I was like, yeah. And so that was going good, but then my husband was working full time and then he was laid off from his job. So then it's okay. And so he was starting about maybe wanting start his own company. I was like, we can't do this. We can't both do this, right? Because again, I honestly, I was probably scared to look at our budget, yeah. Be like, but, and it's different because, and I feel like this is, if I could go back in time, I think I just, I wish I would've had more mentors from a financial aspect.'cause my parents didn't they were like, they worked for the same company for 30 years. They retired. The only kind of savings they have is like a CD or like a mm-hmm. A money market at a bank. They didn't do anything else out of that. So I, I didn't know anything different than that. And so I, I wished earlier on in my career, I would have had more mentors to tell me how to invest, right? Or tell me to get into real estate or just different things to help my financial strength. So then if it came a time like this now, 20 years later. Where we wanted some kind of runway to be able to survive on our own and try to start up companies, then we would have it. So that's probably my biggest kind of, if I could give people advice, it would be to, early on try to, grow your financial strength or at least know how to, when the, when you get to a point when you can. And so to your point, I did make the decision that I could find a job quicker than he could. And so I, went back to looking and a recruiter reached out to me about a role. And so I'm back in corporate and I'm managing, product at a bank. And so it's actually what I did my first 10 years of my career. So it's like my brain's trying to grab it. It's it's been 10 years ago, but I did it for 10 years. And so it is, it's, I'm gonna say it's fun. It's also very demanding. But it is fun to have a team again. Yeah. To be managing product at a large bank again, and really growing the business. So fun, but very demanding. And that's, I hadn't been used to that, so that's been a hard transition. But one of the customers that I had for my own company, when I signed the contract, the actual, what I'm doing for them isn't until about a month. Yeah. And so I did, I was able to get approval. From my company that I work for an outside business activity. I got the email. It was like, your outside business activity has been approved. And I was like, yes.'cause I feel like if the company didn't approve it, then it was gonna be crushing my dreams. Yeah. But I think to your point, it kind of ebbs and flows.'cause ultimately I'd love to do that full time, but it is also very stressful too. So I was like, you know what? After I do this, I'm probably just gonna put a pause on things. But again, I think it's just at this time, I work on my book while I'm on planes because that's the only time it's just me. Yeah. And I actually, I love that. And I, that's why I flew last week and it's it's kind of my nirvana when I look out the plane window and I call it my sea of white'cause it's just when you're above the clouds. And so I can really see that and then my brain starts shifting gears into writing. And so I am. I think a little bit over halfway in my book where I've actually written, so I've like pen and paper writing. I've never written a book before. I've written a lot of poems too, so I'm hoping to turn that into, maybe incorporate it in the book or actually have a collection of poems as well. And, and I have a lot of other notes too. So I feel like once I actually can, and I don't know at what point, but once I actually sit down and can focus on bringing everything together, I may actually be really close to being done with it, or at least the first book. Yeah. So that's how I'm juggling everything right

Megan: 25:25

now. Yeah. That's amazing. I love the idea of using that time in the air, which I've heard a lot of people talk about that's like my time.'cause it is often as for, people who travel for business, the only time they have where they're just by themselves, that's theirs. So I love that you're using that time for that. That's amazing. And there is something about having a routine that can get you into a different head space so that, being up above the clouds that's really cool. And then, yeah, also with the corporate and entrepreneurship piece is there's pros and cons to both. So like you were saying, it's great to have a team and all of that's really fun, but it can be quite demanding being in corporate. But then an entrepreneur, everything's on you, so you might have flexibility in terms of your schedule, but your sales, your marketing, your. Doing the job you're doing, the admin, the, the accounting, all of that stuff falls on you. So that has its own kind of pressure, especially when you're just getting started and looking for clients to come in. And I think sometimes people, in both cases just focus, the grass is always greener kind of situation of if you're a corporate, it's oh, I wanna do my own thing because. I wanna be in control of my schedule without thinking of the different kind of work you have to do. And flip side, I think some entrepreneurs sometimes are like, oh, it'd be nice to just go to a nine to five and not have to worry about all the extra work. But there's different pressure that comes with that.

Genevieve: 26:57

Yeah. And that's been something I think I've learned later in my career as well, is to. Seek out something you potentially want to do, right? Hey, I might wanna be the CEO yeah. Of a company, or I might wanna go be a founder, or I might wanna go be a paid motivational speaker full-time. So what I've done, and again, I probably should have probably done this earlier in my career but later. Like I go to people who are doing that. Yeah. Who's just a founder who's a paid motivational speaker. I'm like, what does your life look like? Right. And yeah, what advice would you give me?'cause I was actually just a few months ago talking to my friend who she founded a company five years ago and she's even telling me, Hey, I've been trying to make it work. Right. We have a heloc. Going back to that financial, like how are you doing this, right? They took out a home equity line and that's been her salary basically in between when she's not getting income and from customers, but she's I'll be honest with you I've got six months and if I don't get a new customer in six months, I'm gonna have to go back to corporate. And so she's like, no, stay put. You know? Where I have another gentleman who's like. No, I can help you get in the paid motivational speaking, you go work with a speaker's bureau. But there's things you don't know about until you ask someone who's doing it, their, their perspective and hopefully you get people that are honest with you, right. And helpful with resources. So that's been a huge a huge, I don't know, thing I would recommend for people if they're interested. Kinda to your point of is the grass greener? What does it actually look like? Tell me all the things, right? Yeah.

Megan: 28:23

I love that question of what does your life look like?'cause it's not just about the job, it's all the other things around the job and what does a day in the life look like? Yeah. I love that question, but I've been

Genevieve: 28:35

intentional. Instead of saying like, how are you doing? I'm like, how is your health? How's your job and how's your family? Because I feel like those are like the kind of the theme the themes, of what you want that, that look into.

Megan: 28:49

Amazing. Which kind of leads to, again, we've touched on this a little bit, but if you could go back in time, are there pieces of advice you would, would go back and give yourself, like you mentioned the financial mentorship and looking at financials differently, for example. But what advice would you go back in time and give yourself?

Genevieve: 29:13

I think really what I've touched on already the financial, how to be financially strong. Again, I think what we were just talking about, looking into potential careers or lifestyles and actually talking to people who are in those, I think, some of my. Most amazing moments have come from me being what I didn't know at the time, but it was brave and vulnerable in sharing. Right. My story you touched on it earlier, but it's like I've seen this quote so I can't take credit for it, but it's basically like, you sharing your story will become someone else's survival guide. And I think I just, I feel like as human beings, we have that responsibility to pay it forward. And so I'm really passionate about that, but I think that's when I've received. Some of the greatest help is when I've, shared with someone, a tough situation I'm going through, and then they either help me directly or they put me in contact with someone who can help me. Or they just, they have advice or someone that can have advice. I think, people have saying being vulnerable is a superpower, and it's, I just never knew. I've always lived in honest, transparent. Type of a lifestyle, and I guess I just thought other people did too. So I didn't think it was necessarily special, but I guess it is, especially in business settings. And. Early in my career, which I don't think it was bad necessarily, because I think at certain places, depending on what your goals are you do have to kind of, I hate to say, play a certain game, right? Or follow a certain set of rules to be promoted. And not in a negative way per se. Because that could be, I felt taken outta context, but more so I'll give you an example of like my first career and I was promoted and I was. I moved up pretty fast and at a young age, but it was, the advice was kinda keep your head down, don't say anything in meetings, just do a good job and you'll get recognized. Or I was told, if you do say something in a meeting, especially if like our senior leadership is in there. Make sure that what you say makes sense. Make sure that if you're bringing up an issue, you also have a solution. If you're bringing up some data points, make sure you have facts and stats and so that advice was so overwhelming because then it like scared people into. Basically being silent in meetings, right? Yeah. Almost picture, a girl that has her hand over her mouth and it's like this invisible person, like telling her to be quiet.

Megan: 31:39

Unless you're perfect and you have all the answers don't say anything.

Genevieve: 31:43

Right. Right. And so that's been a big piece that I mentor younger women on is Yeah. Be mindful in what you're saying, but don't be afraid to speak out. Mm-hmm. And even if someone says, and you're say like, well, I'm not sure that we're doing it in the most efficient way, or something like that. Right. And then maybe someone explains, well this is why we do it this way. And it's oh, that makes sense. Or, thank you for clarifying for me. Or if it's, oh yeah, we, we never thought of doing it another way. You bring up a great point you know, I'm always like of the mindset, and I think this is advice. I would've had earlier on, as well as what's the worst that can happen, right? Yeah. Play that out in your head and if it is just, no, this is how we do it this way. It's oh, okay, cool. At least like your voice was heard. You were inquisitive, right? Something else that I learned, probably about 10 years into my career was, and this I have to credit Elizabeth Lyons too, she has has authored some books. So she plays in that space of, she works for corporate, but she also has her own company. She's also an author. You noticed, that's. Kind of, I have different circles, right, of people that I've made friends with again, for more of a mentor potential, similar career path. But she did this one talk that I attended that it, she highlighted diminishing phrases, that women say in the workplace, but all genders say it. Ultimately, and it's like, I'm sorry I am late. Right? And instead of saying that, say thank you for your patience.

Megan: 33:04

Yeah.

Genevieve: 33:04

You see how the two I just love that because it two totally different sounds there.

Megan: 33:09

They're saying the same thing, but they're the. The perception and the others get when they hear them. And just even yourself it makes a big difference.

Genevieve: 33:20

Yeah. So a lot of places don't ever say, I'm sorry. Right? That's what normally you can say thank you for something. Instead of saying, I'm sorry, or, I think don't say, I think say whatever it is or. I believe Don't say that. Just get right to the fact, right. Or whatever it is you're saying.'cause then you're gonna be probably backing it up. I think just using succinct language, not overthinking things. I think there's things that kind of we potentially do to our detriment. But that was, I think, a piece of advice that I wish I would've heard earlier in my career.

Megan: 33:51

Yeah. And I think that, I. It is important advice of there are professional nuances, so you have to learn those. But also, you know what you said of what's the worst that can happen and then balance that with what's also the best that could happen. And that range, the worst that can happen is never as bad as you think And you're, starting to hear that a lot more. And also what you said about just being vulnerable it's so important, but can be so hard. So it, maybe it does come naturally to you. And so you don't realize you're being brave. But even in your journey as we've been talking, there have been multiple examples of oh, we don't talk about this enough, like being in the sandwich generation. And so sometimes it's just that of actually we're not alone in so many of the experiences we're having. And so by sharing, we can find community and advice and help. And like you said, that's how you been able to. Find help or get new mentors or learn about people's career journeys or learn more about things you might be interested in. So I think that's really amazing.

Genevieve: 34:57

Yeah, and I think, you know what I'd probably add on to, and I know we touched on it earlier on, but I think I've seen it more with my kids, right? The generational shifts. I mentioned my parents, right? They worked at the same job for 30 years, retired and. For as long as I can remember as a kid, it was, you're gonna, graduate high school, go to college, get a job, get married, like in that order, and it was very like I knew nothing else and I didn't even think to question it, right? Mm-hmm. So I just knew that's what they're telling me to do. And it's interesting because neither of my parents graduated college. So I'm a first gen college graduate. And I didn't really like that really till later in, in life. And it's. Interesting. Now, again, going back to the piece of advice, because I, of course I taught with my kids, but then I also, when I moved back home to my hometown, I go and speak to our middle school, high school, and we have our early college program here as well. I speak to them and I'm like, sure, you could go to college. Here's what kind of my journey look like. And the amazing things I got to do, especially growing up in this small town where, again, you just don't see a lot of that. But I also talk about other options, right? And it is funny because both my kids, for some reason, they're like, I'm never getting married. Right? I'm never having kids. Yeah. I'm just gonna go, I just wanna have my own company. My daughter says she wants to be a doctor. She wants to have her own practice, and then she wants to have a nonprofit where she gives away her services. So I'm like. Amazing. She was only 12. But to, I just love that they have this different mindset than like our generation did. Yeah. And even the one before that is, thinking more about that full picture of what you know white, what life looks like or just different career options that are out there. I know a friend of mine that I graduated with, she did some college but then she stopped and she was an artist and she ended up. Being a tattoo artist and she owns her own tattoo parlor now. How cool. And then I know a gentleman who, he owns his own home inspection company for real estate. Yeah. But then he's also a lead guitarist in a band and they play, gigs all the time. And so I just, I love giving just all these, examples that are all over the board just saying, you don't have to get pigeonholed into this. One, avenue.

Megan: 37:00

A hundred percent like you don't. When you're in high school, just like you and your friend being like, why do we have to choose right now? Yeah. You don't know all the roles. You don't know all the possibilities and like the easiest way to discover what you like is to try some things. And it's, one of the things even with this podcast I'm hoping to do is share different people's stories.'cause everyone's journey is different and unique and. The way they make decisions is different and the whys of things and how they ended up in places. It's all very different. And no one, I don't know anyone whose career has been like, I'm gonna take this at, in high school where they're like, I'm taking this at university and then I'm gonna be doing this when I get out. And then that's what they're doing. Yeah. There's some people who are doing kind of in the range, but that's very uncommon. And. It's just like taking the pressure off a little bit of a, when you're young and making those decisions that it's gonna be okay and not all these decisions are life or death decisions, but. For all of us in the journey of, if you get laid off or you're not happy in what you're doing or what have you there are lots of avenues available, or even if you love your industry, but you get an opportunity to join a different company. Like all these decisions, they're big and they're important, but they aren't life or death, and it's okay to make new decisions and. Make mistakes and make new decisions from there. So yeah, I love that and I love that it's also how you're speaking with high school students and your own kids. That's amazing.

Genevieve: 38:37

Yeah. And I think that's the key. You touched on it multiple times there. I think I actually, in getting back to the title of your podcast, and that's what I've tried to talk to the younger, generation about, is that yeah, you can change. Like literally, I'm over here at 41 years old. I'm like, what do I wanna be when I grow up? You know? But I think it, it still goes back to that financial piece of it is oh, you can change, but then what's needed to change? And then I think again, having that big network or a strategic network rather people you can lean on for help is really important too.

Megan: 39:08

Yeah, a hundred percent. Like looking forward,'cause you've got so many things on the go, what's your vision for the future, whether that's the short term future or longer term?

Genevieve: 39:19

Yeah it's interesting because, yeah, a little bit different place than I was. I think I was two. I'm trying to think. When I spoke at money 20, 22 years ago, 2023 I remember standing on the stage and saying, I don't know what's next. And that's okay. And I think that's a powerful statement in itself. Yeah. And I, because I did feel. Fickled a bit.'cause I, there was just some things I didn't like about my corporate job. And I think I was wanting to do, my own company for my full-time job. But I do feel like I'm in a better place now where I am enjoying, my kind of corporate job. I do have customers now. So I think it, and I think the theme of this is things ebb and flow. I always say it's like the waves of the ocean, though I fall, I'll rise, always trying to keep that in mind. Yes. I think the short term is just continue on with my current company because I, it is going well. Like I said, I'm not sure how much energy I'm gonna continue to put in my own business. I'm gonna I think, and that's what happened. I feel like things happen and then here's two years later, all of a sudden I get this opportunity. We'll see. I think that's gonna change on a daily, how I feel about that, depending on my stress level. I do wanna continue pursuing the book and actually, and I used to have this goal of I wanna be a published author by this. Age. And I've thrown that out the window because what I've realized with writing is my story isn't over. And as I am like writing, I referenced things that are happening today and I was like I couldn't have been done with the book, a year ago if I'm referencing things that are happening today. I've tried to let off of that goal. So it's just more of like at some point, hopefully in the more near future, but but I'm not giving any kind of timestamp on that. But definitely wanna finish the book. I think the bigger vision is I would love for when the book is done, I. And this is, this may be crazy, but it's my vision, so maybe not is for it to actually be adapted into a movie or a series and even if, yeah, that's what I would would love to happen. And then I would love to have, maybe multiple, books as well and more so from the idea of my story helping people. That's always a big passion of mine is watching these true story light like movies and even with my kids and the kind of learning from that or being inspired from that. And that's ultimately what I would love to do when we talk about, the legacy that I leave behind. That's amazing.

Megan: 41:39

And you have to put it out in the world for it to happen. So I love that. Amazing. Thank you. I can't wait till your book comes out. And yeah, I just loved hearing your journey and how you made decisions along the way, but also how you're now finding this new balance of the corporate world. You do have a, a client in the entrepreneurial and then writing the book and going with those ebbs and flows and seeing where you take it. Like I I think that's really interesting and really inspiring also. Thank you so much for sharing.

Genevieve: 42:17

Thank you so much for giving me the opportunity to share and then for doing this podcast. I, I look up to you for that. That's something I have on my vision board too, but I'm nowhere near to that being a reality, so I've applaud you for that.

Megan: 42:30

Me. Thank you. And if you do decide to launch one, let me know. I'm happy to answer any questions about my experience of doing it. Cool. Again, thank you so much.

Genevieve: 42:40

Awesome.

42:41

Genevieve's career is so inspiring. A few things that I took from her journey were, one, the importance of looking at the big picture from deciding what university to go to and her first job, she looked at the big picture of what kind of experience and life she wanted. Two, following the ebb and flow and adjusting how you define balance to what works for where you happen to be in your career journey and in your life. And three, the importance of being vulnerable. I love how Genevieve isn't afraid to share her experiences and give back in her community and in her wider network. Her advice too about developing financial acumen early and the importance of a good network is really great advice as it can create the foundations that will allow you to explore or pivot when you need or want to. Thank you for listening to the unexpected career podcast, please follow, share and rate on your favorite podcast provider. The unexpected career podcast is produced, edited and hosted by me, Megan Dunford. See you next week.