The Unexpected Career Podcast

Yasmin Ulrich: From Professional Tennis to Emerging Payments Leader

• Megan Dunford • Season 3 • Episode 8

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S3E8: Yasmin Ulrich was pursuing a professional tennis career when injury had her face some difficult new career decisions.

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Welcome to the Unexpected Career Podcast, where we share stories of real people and the twists and turns they have taken along their career journey. I am Megan Dunford, and as someone who found myself in the payments industry, largely by accident, I'm fascinated by how people's careers unfold and how they've gotten to where they are today. It's also why I'm passionate about reducing the pressure on young people, about going to university, what to take in school, and on getting that right first job my guest today is Yasmin Ulrich, who was on the road to a professional tennis career and is now a leader in emerging and integrated payments.

Megan:

First of all, I thank you for doing this

Yasmin:

for having me.

Megan:

I am excited to dig into your story and we'll get into it, but I think you are the first person I've spoken to who has that really athletic start early in life. So I'm excited to explore, that part of your story, but then how it's led to what you're doing now as well.

Yasmin:

Let's do it.

Megan:

I start every conversation with the very beginning of when you were small, what did you want to be when you grew up?

Yasmin:

Yeah, so basically growing up, the only thing I knew and I wanted to be in life almost up until I turned 17, was be a professional tennis player. My entire life evolved around that. I started around the age of four and that's way before you even have exposure to different topics in school, different subjects, right? You don't even really know what's out there. You're not trying to think about what do I wanna be? You are just a newborn and then a couple years old and you just think about learning language and what is this world I live in? And everything is new and foreign and you're learning, so you really never have a thought of, oh, what do I wanna be? It was just way too soon. At that age, I already started being on a tennis court almost daily, so that's really all I knew growing up. And then obviously I also went to school. Then in parallel, come age six. However, nothing ever sparked my interest as much. And nothing was such a substantial part of my life growing up as tennis. And it was really interesting, I believe until the age of 12, there was always at least two hours of tennis training every day after school.

Megan:

Wow.

Yasmin:

And then come 13, I was out of school to really play full-time six hours a day. We didn't just play tennis for six hours, but there was a lot of physical exercise, a lot of mental training, a lot of rehab and making sure our bodies stay healthy, given the pressure we had at that young age. And eating right and everything evolves around staying healthy, but also getting better, being competitive and really studying tennis. So it was really my first scholarship in life and super exciting way to grow up, and I really didn't notice how different it was from other kids growing up until I played this one tournament in Italy and Italy has a really interesting tennis club markup in the city you play on a rooftop, so all the tennis, most tennis courts downtown. On a rooftop and we had this one tournament, we were just practicing early morning, I think it was eight o'clock, and right next building was a school. And all the school kids ran to the window and looked at us playing tennis and we looked at them being in school. And that's when it hit me like, oh, this a normal life a kid at that age should live. And I had these moments where it hit me, but tennis was really all I knew growing up. Long answer to your question, but it was always tennis.

Megan:

That's amazing. And you clearly pursued it. A lot of kids, that first idea of what sparks their interest, they either aren't able to pursue it or that evolves, but you really pursued it. So how long did you play tennis for?

Yasmin:

I played until I just was about to turn 17 years old and interesting by the time I just entered the world ranking list when I was 16. So you collect points and it's really what you see on tv, the wta. I started playing those tournaments, for the professionals and I was ranked 900 something in the world in women's tennis. But at around the same time, however, I was struggling with a knee injury. That was on and off and sometimes had me interrupt an entire match and drop out of a tournament, so it was very frustrating. Random. Pain and I have a pretty high pain tolerance. I used to play once with a broken wrist and I didn't notice it. I'm left-handed, so my left wrist was broken and I would serve, and the racket flew out of my hand and I knew I had pain. I just didn't imagine it was broken. So my pain tolerance really up there, but my knee. On and off forced me to see a lot of different doctors. I've been to a lot of different therapies, tried everything you can imagine under the sun and the last trial we did was a surgery. And coming out of surgery, the doctors promised you will be healed coming out of this. So I took my recovery time, six weeks roughly, went back on a tennis court, same pain, and that's when I just had to make a decision. You're not in school for the last three years, but you also not healthy. So becoming a professional athlete is your chances already so minimal and so low. Very few people make it out of everybody trying it. But if your body's not playing along, it, it will not work. There's a hundred percent failure rate if you're not healthy. Right? Yeah. And if you have an injury that you're struggling with. So at that point, I'm almost 17, I just made that decision that I have to go back to school. I have to build a different life than I always envisioned, and it was incredibly hard, and I think that was the first time I had a depression because all I knew and all I loved was taken away from me overnight post-surgery. And I just didn't wanna be at a point in life where I'm in my twenties, didn't make it in tennis, but also didn't learn or study anything else. Yeah. And that's when I went back to school and gave up on tennis. I actually had a tennis trainer's license that I got around age 15. Also, way too young. Most people have it in their mid twenties. So I'm sitting there as a kid studying, getting my trainer's license and training people. So I trained players for a while and also modified who I train and how I train over the years. That's a really interesting evolution as well. And then going back to school, I had a teacher that literally told me and only me that I should never apply to bank. Here we're,

Megan:

and yeah, you're in financial services.

Yasmin:

Right. So she really gave me that idea and I never heard the do not apply. I always heard bank and I heard it only towards me. She didn't tell any other kid. For some background on this because of tennis, I moved quite a bit in Germany because the further you go south, it's interesting. I don't know why that is really, but the further you go south, the better the tennis academies were. So from my hometown, I moved south and I was exposed to very different different school system, totally different curriculum. And I tried my best to catch up in all the subjects, but math was one where I just was two years behind.

Megan:

Yeah.

Yasmin:

And I had six weeks to catch up and I tried. I studied every single day throughout those six weeks where every other kid's on school break, summer break, and it was just not enough time for me to get caught up to the math curriculum. Everything else worked, but. Based on how math is staggered and how it progresses, I just couldn't keep up. I was always great in math before moving all the way south and falling behind in curriculum, and that's really where that came from. From my math teacher.

Megan:

Yeah, six weeks is not enough time to catch up on two years of math. So

Yasmin:

that's Try it. That's try it. But the school system kind of fails people in a way, how it's structured. If anybody moves throughout their school year, it's really hard to catch up in that subject.

Megan:

Yeah. It can be, complicated, when I was in school, different circumstances, but we moved to the other side of the country, so same like different province, different curriculum. I had always done math in French. Suddenly math was in English. So even that, and then they were just at a different point. There were things that we had done that they hadn't started yet, but then there were things they started that I had never seen before. So it's just, yeah, it's interesting how that can do it, and that's so unfair of a teacher to then make a comment as if that's a comment of your intelligence when it has nothing to do with that. It's just I don't think

Yasmin:

she knew my backstory. I also. Now looking back, feel like it was great because I had no idea. All I knew was tennis. I knew nothing else, and I'm actually really grateful for her that she kept saying this because again, my brain only took in the bank. Only

Megan:

remembered bank.

Yasmin:

And one day after she said it to me a couple of times, and it wasn't every week or every day. Yeah. But she said it enough to where I heard it and I thought about it and I'm sitting on a statement and she didn't know my background or the fact that I moved states and this is why I am struggling. I just need some help. And, never really got it. But she gave me that idea that I really didn't have on my radar. I almost went into biochemistry.

Megan:

Wow.

Yasmin:

And tapped into work and the labor. And so the, the bank statement really got me on an interesting different path that I didn't have on my radar until then.

Megan:

I love that just ignore the don't part and remember the word bank. And with tennis being ripped away from you, that's a really difficult thing. I think it's difficult at any age, but especially, at 17 when your whole life is in front of you and you think you know what you're gonna be pursuing. so tennis is finished and now you have this word, bank in your mind. So what was that transition? How did you transition from that dream of tennis to this world of financial services and banking?

Yasmin:

That also had an interesting start. It will explain my mindset and who I am a little better, but I first applied in my hometown for their local bank. It's like a union bank equivalent. So my hometown is Han. It's a small town, 250,000 people. And that's where I went back to finish my school. It's right at the border to Belgium and Netherlands. It's a really nice area, but also very small and not a lot of change there. And I applied and they rejected me. And it was a generic reason that they have so many applicants.

Megan:

Mm-hmm.

Yasmin:

And apparently nothing about me or my application stood out to them enough to give it a shot. And now there's that math fell behind a little bit. So that was also a little visible, not too terrible. But they only wanted the top math students, obviously, right? We're now talking banking. So I got rejected, and again, my brain took this interesting twist on, oh, I think they're too small. They rejected me because life has a different path for me. So I applied at the Deutsche Bank headquarters in Frankfurt. Way bigger city. I didn't even live there. Really shot for by the time, the biggest global bank and definitely the biggest one in Germany and they accepted me. So that really kicked off my career in global transaction banking. So two weeks later I finished my school, I moved to Frankfurt, pack up and leave everything behind and started working. And my team's interest was actually my background as a tennis player and they. Had this interesting, thought of, hey, this is a resilient person with hard work ethics, and there are a lot of qualities that really translate into the banking world. It has an international component. You travel a lot, and Deutsche Bank was, is still to this day. Very international bank, right? You can't go larger if you are looking at German banks. And they just found all these different aspects so interesting and so valuable that they gave me a chance. So a couple weeks later I started there, and to this day, I am grateful that my local hometown bank rejected me because there was no growth. It's literally. The bank is only present in that one city. And from there you really can't go anywhere else, not even to a different city in Germany. So that really started everything. It was an interesting way to get there.

Megan:

That's amazing. I think, there's so many things that I love about it, but first of all, your mindset. And I think from an outsider's perspective, that really sounds to me like that. Athlete's mindset of, okay, that's not working for me, but we'll just go about it a different way. Like it's a challenge rather than a closing of a door. So, I think that's really cool and I love that Deutsche Bank looked at who you were as a person and the skill sets from your experience that maybe wasn't traditional, like fine, you didn't have the top math mark, but recognizes the kind of skills that came from your experience and what you would've learned through tennis. And I think. Maybe we're getting more of that now, but I think that was, fairly rare. So, I think that's amazing and yeah, set you on a completely different trajectory. knowing where you are now that probably wouldn't have happened if you got that role in the bank in your hometown.

Yasmin:

It was still really rare back then. I think this was my first experience that started a trend that I've seen throughout life with myself and others, and I theme it giving people a chance, and there was just one person that trusted in me and had the confidence to give me a chance because every other manager would've probably also rejected me. Or maybe not even have responded, but sometimes it takes that one person, my math teacher could have done it in a different way, right? Yeah. But instead she said something that got me on a really nice path that now enables me to have fun at work and got me into the right industry. I don't think I would've been happy with what I initially explored in biochemistry, being in a lab all day. That's just not me. And. Sometimes it just takes one person to see something in you and trust in you and really give you a chance. And to your point, it is rare and I had that happen to me several times in life, and I make it a constant effort to now do that to others. It's a big theme in my life and I could talk about this one all day, but sometimes that's all it takes. And then for you getting a chance to be aware of what you were given and to understand the value of it and the confidence somebody else puts in you and the trust and also their name and reputation a lot of times. And to really do your best and not mess it up is so hyper important to not just take it for granted, but to notice when these situations appear, treat them accordingly and outperform and do the best and say thank you in a way that you can really bring your best self to the table every single day. So that's what I did. I worked really hard. This lady actually had me working until like 2:00 AM a lot of nights. She was building a team. It was very high dynamic and it was a lot of fun. And that was my first role in, in the banking world. And it reminded me so much of tennis, right? You practice every day, including weekends, you have tournaments. It's high pressure, highly competitive. International. So to me it felt like home almost instantly.

Megan:

I love that. And actually that's a perspective I wouldn't have considered of even that culture being similar in terms of that high pressure environment. Amazing. And so knowing where you are today and you're in the US now and in a different role. Can you tell me a little bit about that journey from that first role at Deutsche Bank to where you are today and how did you make decisions along the way? what was that journey like?

Yasmin:

Yes, for sure. And there's a lot of evolution and change in there, especially my first couple of years starting out, the Deutsche Bank role was limited to. I forgot it was like six or nine months in the beginning because it's been so long, maybe nine months. And when my time was up, they just could not extend me because they did not have a full-time role at the time. And that was also financial crisis. So banks are really not hiring at that point. And my next steps were a couple of steps in between to where. I didn't feel challenged and my day-to-day looked the exact same, and you almost had to switch off your brain cells. You couldn't bring in your own ideas or your own energy or improve a process because everything was so written in stone and you are just executing without thinking about it. And I noticed very quickly, you know it almost in your first week. When they're showing you what your task to do and you're starting the job, you're now in it. And I had three roles back to back where that was the case. And I got bored and I tapped out because my brain needed a challenge. I wanted to learn, I wanted to grow, I wanted to do something interesting, and I can do repetitive task, but not the exact same thing every day. That's not my, that's not where I flourish. So I changed banks several times in Germany and then. My last role was actually an interesting one because the bank was about to shut down. We got small and smaller and smaller, but I finally had an interesting role. I was working on product and on a payments product and also investment product, and it was just great. The job is great. It's exciting. And I tapped a little bit into marketing, into the legal aspect, product strategy, so it was perfect for me. But then the bank lost their assets and really went down the drain almost to shutting down. And I didn't have any work, so my friend called me from a different city. And she said, Hey, I know your English is really good. Do you have time on weekends? And I said, yeah, I do have a lot of time currently. What do you need? I'm translating for Western Union. So she was translating marketing documents for Western Union Business Solutions. Mm-hmm. Where you, Megan, that's how we met. And Western Union Business Solutions was getting ready to enter. Germany and Austria. So they tapped into two different markets and I was the one translating and now I'm translating foreign currency documents and my first translations, when you look at terms as cable or kiwi and things like that, and you see, I have no idea what that means. And that's how I learned fx. And then a couple months into translating. Daily FX market updates. They called me and they had a roll open and that's how I started Western Union and it's been 10 years. I Wow. I've spent a decade at that company in different roles. And that was spot on. You connect the dots. International doesn't go more global than that.

Megan:

Yeah.

Yasmin:

Also high pressure. Super interesting. Constant growth. And it was a fun journey with Western Uni business solutions.

Megan:

That's crazy. I did not realize that's your first introduction was translating the daily FX update.

Yasmin:

At 5:00 AM you know it right, because they were literally distributed to our clients early in the morning. Yeah. So I got the whole file. It took me about an hour when I first started. And then you get faster because it's repetitive over time. Yeah. But when you first get introduced to terminology, it took me a lot of research to understand what we even talking about here. And I love that space. I love the international component of it. Love currency trading. To this day, it was a really. Really great job. Very interesting role.

Megan:

Such a interesting, there's something you said just there too about you had to research to understand all the terminologies that you were translating it correctly. It's such a, quite a random but amazing way to get to know a business.

Yasmin:

It was perfect, but you know it, there's a lot of terminology.

Megan:

Yeah.

Yasmin:

That you're not exposed to in different parts of banking, especially now transaction banking to that extent, not even at Deutsche Bank, with a blink being so global, it was more global cash management. But FX is so specific and I literally thought, I can't do it in my first week or two. I thought, this is too much. I can't do it. And she couldn't do it, so I couldn't give it back to her. But she wanted to keep the job right because she was self-employed by the time and translating, but also not translating in banking. She was specialized in something slightly different. So yeah, just took it on and learned it and I had the capacity to, because I didn't feel maxed out or didn't feel challenged enough in my day to day by then. And it all worked out really nicely.

Megan:

That's amazing. I love that. And yeah, a great example of serendipity you were helping someone out, you had some time on your hands'cause you weren't challenged in your job and it ultimately led to a job. You wouldn't have known that when you agreed to do it. And not only a job, but somewhere where you ended up working for 10 years. So pretty cool.

Yasmin:

Yeah, it really turned into a career that also, that's what you asked earlier that also led me to the us So it was in. 2018 when Western Union launched their first in-house leadership class. They had a lot of interest. And it was interesting because by the time I was actually looking to leave the company, and I have never spoken about this. To anyone publicly or on that platform as yours now. But I really didn't see a lot more development for me. By the time my learning curve was done, I needed new input again, I needed to grow again. I really felt it. I started public speaking around the same time because that's always been one of my biggest fears that I wanted to tackle. And then here we are and all of a sudden, this leadership academy, project came up, or opportunity came up, and that ultimately in 2019 then moved me to Western Union's headquarters in Denver. I never thought I would end up in Denver, Colorado, ever. I never had it on my radar. I never actively pursued it. I didn't even think it was a possibility. It was just so far beyond my understanding of what I thought was possible and then. Came the random call, Hey, we really would like for you to be in Denver. How fast can you move? And I said, what? What do you mean? And that all kick started the entire process of moving. And as you know, there's a lot of paperwork behind it and time and energy going into just that and focus.

Megan:

Mm-hmm.

Yasmin:

But it all worked out also. Denver is beautiful. I never really had it on my radar. I never visited before. I always thought I'm a beach girl. I absolutely fell in love with the mountains and they're not your typical mountains like we have them in Germany and what I've known before, but Denver was really. Beautiful place on earth. Couldn't have been more happy and grateful. And again, somebody gave me a chance, right? Somebody believed in me and gave me a chance to move me. And there's a lot of time and money and effort behind the process. And I recognized it at such, and I was really scared, Megan, to be honest with you. It was so scary to move with literally a suitcase and a carry on. And have nothing and don't know anyone outside of work.

Megan:

Yeah,

Yasmin:

and it's so rewarding. There's so much growth in moving country or even moving within your country. Just moving and being in a different environment is so rewarding. I highly recommend it. If anyone hears this and they're thinking about this, do it. If you're scared, do it even more so, and you can always come back if you don't like it. That's a good thing. It's never set in stone or if you do it, it's your final destination. No, if you don't like it, try it out. Give it a fair shot. I always wanted to give it at least 12 months and then make a decision, but I fell in love with Denver four weeks in. It was beautiful. Wow. Yeah.

Megan:

I think that's really good advice too of what an amazing opportunity to grow and learn about yourself in a different way when you move. Like I did a similar but opposite move where moving from Canada to the UK and same thing it completely changed my life. And not in the obvious ways of being in a different place, obviously, of course. Right. But also for me personally, like just finding who I am. There's lots of ways to learn that, I guess. But it's a kind of a shortcut of really getting to know yourself.

Yasmin:

A hundred percent. Couldn't agree more, Megan. It's an experience where I feel like you know yourself at a different and new level. Like you are exposed to things you feel like you should know, and all of a sudden you're in a totally different system. Everything. I remember the first time I just got my car in Denver and I had to pump gas, and this is super silly probably to anyone hearing it, but it's so real. I didn't know how it works. It was so different from pumping gas in Germany.

Megan:

Mm-hmm.

Yasmin:

I had to ask for help, and now I'm an adult and I'm asking another adult, can you help me pump gas? And for some reason I found this older patient, man. Denver, who is so kind and nice to take a couple of minutes and explain every button to me and the process and the steps to follow, but that literally almost resets you and humbles you because you think, I don't know how you were around the time, but you feel a little independent, right? I'm moving to a different country and it's just me and you can do it, and then all of a sudden you need help doing simple daily life. Things, it really helps, like you said, it helps you get to know you on a very simple, humbling level. But also on that really hyper-growth level. At the same time, it is really rewarding. I would do it all over again. It's a beautiful journey.

Megan:

I a hundred percent agree it's something everyone should do to your point, it could be to a different city. It doesn't always have to be to a different country, but, yeah, get out there and try and like every decision in life, moving somewhere is not a forever decision. You can always change your mind, so I love that.

Yasmin:

It's definitely hard. I would love to hear how that was for you, but it's really difficult to leave your family and friends behind mm-hmm. And be away physically away from the strongest support system that you have in life. That's one thing that I still struggle with, and I'm six years in. I can't just go over and drive to my best friend or help them out. If I see somebody needs help or my uncle just passed two weeks ago, I can't be there. It is incredibly difficult. And that's one that is just tricky or they're in different time zones. It's really hard when I come off work and maybe I wanna share something exciting or a challenge I'm struggling with or something I'm dealing with with my family or friends, they're sleeping.

Megan:

Mm-hmm.

Yasmin:

It's really hard to connect the time zones. It's difficult to not be face to face or know they're close enough. I can't be there. It always takes a trip. It always takes a long flight. And planning and scheduling, taking time off work, that's really the one difficult, challenge with that, especially if the move is far. So hopefully, everybody considering this is able to bring their people and their support system with them. And if not, there are ways to figure it out. Like we are doing, we're on Zoom when FaceTime.

Megan:

Yeah,

Yasmin:

gladly. You can do all these things now, can do them for free. Back then you needed a phone card, an international phone calling card. They were so expensive. I remember these days, I had those a lot. And technology makes it easy. It is still different, but it helps, right? Yeah. So you just gotta find your ways to help you through and build a new support system in your new environment.

Megan:

Yeah, a hundred percent. And I think we are lucky in this day and age of technology makes the distance a little bit closer. Like you can't physically be there, but you can at least see people's faces and it doesn't cost anything. Like WhatsApp video is how I talk to my parents all the time. So, yeah, it makes a huge difference. So after 10 years at Western Union, what did you decide to do next? And is that what you're still doing? Or have you made more changes since then?

Yasmin:

Yeah. Interesting phase at Western Union. By the time we are now in late 2022, they changed out their CEO and had new leadership and there was a lot of change at the company by the time, which I always love and embrace a lot of times of change.

Megan:

Mm-hmm.

Yasmin:

Because you can always tap in and make sure you contribute in a valuable way to the company and what the company currently needs in those times of change, because it's always slightly different or majorly different to what you were doing until then. And I remember that my team that I was in by the time was completely laid off. Everybody was just cut. And it was my direct manager, her manager, and myself. So the three of us were offered a new role. And I accepted it. I also, by the time had to accept it. I also would've under different circumstances, but I did not have my green card yet. So, you know that whole component of it, Megan? Yeah. But you have to. Stay with the same employer. It brings a lot of difficulties or almost has you move back to your home country if you change your employer or you change the role that you are migrating with. So it's a very fragile process. If you change anything it really puts you at risk and where you are that stage of applying for such a big thing, like the green card. So I had to, but I also wanted to take on the new role interestingly. In my career, actually, my last five roles were all brand new roles newly created. There was nobody else doing the same job before, so that played right along into what I was doing. New role, build a new team. Build a new product. So again, I also wanted to accept it and I took on the new role, out of us. Three, two did. One person decided to leave and take a year leave, and it was perfect where she was in a career and her manager and me, we started building this new team. We did that for nine months almost, to then have that entire team also fully laid off.

Megan:

Oh wow.

Yasmin:

But now suddenly I have my green card. A green card came in, and now at least I had that peace of mind. Mm-hmm. That will not be put at risk. And now I was able to apply different employers, which I also now had to. Right? Mm-hmm. So put me in a position where, that team at Western Union was now entirely made redundant. And also the entire product behind it was sunsetted and we were just building it, but it was also not an innovation. It was something that was really dated and I don't know why it was put back on people's radar and us to work on, but new learnings came with that. And then I looked around you all of a sudden have the entire US. In front of me with all its employers, and I never had that before, right? Mm-hmm. I couldn't even explore previously. Yeah. And now all of a sudden it opens

Megan:

up all the opportunities.

Yasmin:

And now all of a sudden I am free to explore and I don't even need to ask any of those employers to help me with my green card application.

Megan:

Mm-hmm.

Yasmin:

So it was a really good moment for me and I interviewed with a couple of banks, some startups, some fintechs, and by the time then joined JP Morgan. It was also interesting how I always, my dad knows this, he can literally confirm it for the past five years prior to that. Every now and then, I would say if I ever go back to a bank, it will be JP Morgan and for some reason JP Morgan. Not constantly, but maybe once a year dropped out of me and it was always JP Morgan. So I found a job at JP Morgan. Super interesting. Also, again, innovation, new role building something really played into what I love to do and I'm super passionate about. So they, hired me with that. I moved from Denver to Chicago. And all of a sudden I have this mega city in front of me. It's new, it's the biggest city I've lived in to date, and had an interesting journey at JP Morgan for just over two years, two and a half years, and I just recently left to Sunnova, also new role, also banking. Payments, modernization and emerging payments. So that's what I'm doing now. I'm less than a year in, but it's also one where very hands on, I can build something, I can learn more about emerging payments and how to implement and all the steps along of doing so. And that's what I'm doing now.

Megan:

That's amazing. And

Yasmin:

and.

Megan:

You moved again?

Yasmin:

Yeah, I'm in Dallas now. I'm in the Dallas Fort Worth area. So I left Chicago for Cenovus and I'm now, again, in a different city, different climate, same time zone for once, but yeah, again, a new territory.

Megan:

So you're in Texas now, I mean, you have explored a lot of the US probably more than a lot of people who were born in the us. That's pretty incredible.

Yasmin:

There may be some truth behind that statement, unfortunately, but yes, very, very different areas. All three. And I am currently in a stage at Cenovus. We are now going through a merger and we'll see. I hope I don't have to tell you in a couple of months. Hey Megan, I moved to again because at some point you also want to settle in quite a bit. But all three cities, Denver, Chicago, Dallas, are amazing. They are all great places. Great opportunities. There's so much you can do in all three very different flavors, but so much opportunity in all three. And yeah, now I'm here. It's been a couple of months. I just recently got here, but, definitely. Had the nicest tan ever. The weather is beautiful. There's a lot of barbecue. I may have had a little too much at some point, so I had to slow myself down on the barbecue. It's way too good out here, but and it's, if you look at it on the map, Denver, Chicago, and Dallas on a really nice triangle. I actually travel back and forth. Occasionally to both, to Chicago, to Denver'cause you build your little networks there mm-hmm. And you build something and then you move. But it's all in really close proximity. So it all works out.

Megan:

Yeah. That's amazing and so exciting and I'm excited to see how you like Dallas once you've had more time to settle in and hopefully build a foundation, which is exciting.

Yasmin:

You should come visit.

Megan:

Oh, I would love to. I've been to, I've never been to Dallas. I've been to the airport in Houston once. I had a connection there. That's my only experience with Texas.

Yasmin:

Dallas, especially with Fort Worth, being right here, the Dallas Fort Worth complex has. Tons of opportunity. It's beautiful. I hope you got a chance to visit. I would love to take you to barbecue.

Megan:

I'll definitely let you know. That would be amazing. So thinking about this winding journey and really two different paths you've had in your life. If you think back to 15, 16-year-old Yasmin, you were on a path to become a tennis player. So what do you think she would think about where you are now and what you're doing now?

Yasmin:

She would be devastated. What do you mean you're not a pro tennis player? Right? It would be probably at that age because that was the only possibility in my brain. It was everything. I know. It's almost like you eat and breathe and live tennis every single day, and that's the only thing that I was exposed to. And then obviously I was in school, but nothing really caught my passion and my interest and my competitive nature and my constant strive to evolve and be better. As much, right? So she would be entirely devastated initially. It takes growth and time and maturity to appreciate the evolution behind the story. I really do at this point. I am so grateful. I'm on a really great path, banking and the entire banking industry, and you are part of this. Megan, we are so globally connected and it is such a family that's really supportive. We are all in WhatsApp groups. We talk to each other. We support each other. We learn with each other. The banking industry has evolved so much. It is insane. There are so much exciting opportunities. All of a sudden, payments became sexy. That wasn't the case when we first started, right?

Megan:

Yeah, true.

Yasmin:

And it's a really great place that I highly recommend if anyone's interested, they're a little earlier in their career to explore. There's so much to do. It's all globally connected and there's a lot of work where people are needed with a good skillset. Also with ability to implement new solutions with the skillset to remain agile and be open and learn new concepts and just constantly learn. So. I am so glad I left these stagnant roles that had me do the same thing very quickly because it initially hurts your resume.

Megan:

Yeah,

Yasmin:

nobody wants to see you flip flopping around. They're looking for stability. They wanna make sure when they hire you that you will stay for a couple of years and add value to the company. So I'm aware of how that looked, but also I'm a very authentic person and I didn't wanna force myself into something that makes me really unhappy because then at the end of the day, you also don't perform well and it tells, and if you force yourself in such an environment for too long, I also honestly believe it will make you sick. Mm-hmm. In one shape or the other. So the. Back then tennis player, Yasmin that only knew one thing. May also sit on this for a little bit and be happy and proud. Not initially to hear this, but of the journey and the evolution and ultimately, being able to translate a lot of what I learned in tennis and with those years early on into my career now, which is beautiful.

Megan:

Yeah. I know, obviously, it would be a bit of a, as you said, a kind of that evolution and it would be hard to wrap your head around at first. But yeah, you should be really proud of the amazing career and I think it's such a good point of all those skills from tennis, they're not lost skills.

Yasmin:

Yeah.

Megan:

You brought into your career and were a big part of what made you successful. Absolutely. Is there any piece of advice you wish you could go back in time and give yourself?

Yasmin:

I love that question and I don't think so because I am a firm believer that we always receive advice or hints or. Even statements with the bank by the time that we meet them and by the time that we are able to receive them. Because there's most likely a lot of advice people gave me. That at a certain age I didn't receive. I didn't accept it or I didn't receive it. I didn't understand it. I was probably not ready for it. And if it's one thing, I've always been very fortunate to be surrounded with a lot of different people with different backgrounds, different levels of success, and everybody always seemed to have an open mind to me and was open to conversation with me and sharing their thoughts and experiences. And I actually like speaking to older people at all stages in my life. I think they have really interesting journeys. There's tons to learn from and they like to give advice. And yes, there's probably a lot that I ignored, not intentionally or because I wanted to, but I was just not ready to yet. Yeah, so I think with all the advice I got that I was able to receive and able to be actually execute on a implement or sit through and think about how, what this means and how is this going to be helpful for me in becoming a better version of myself. I got them by the time I was ready for them. So looking back, I think everything comes at the time when you're ready for it, and it may have been repetitive. But it could feel like the first time because all of a sudden you're open to it and people will not shy away from advice, especially if we ask for it. That's one thing that I like doing. I like learning from others. I like to hear what you're doing now. You are literally asking, Hey, what's something that you wanna share that you learned? Or How did you get from A to B? What was your thought process behind it? I think there are always some components that we sit on after the fact. It's like, wow, what Megan shared with me was really impactful, and I wanna try to implement that for myself, or I wanna think about this in a way where I can apply and also pass on to the next person. And then one thing we don't always do is tell that person, Hey, there's an advice she gave me. I know it was five years ago. I'm making this up, but, I really was able to finally understand it and implement it, and it helped me do X, Y, Z That is so powerful because we typically don't say back to the person that gave us the advice. If it's a person advice is also come in books or movies or

Megan:

Yeah.

Yasmin:

A sign on the street or a stranger having a conversation at the airport that we pick up. Everything around us could be an advice almost. If we are opening and we're listening, we're keeping our eyes open. But I started making it a point to let that person know and it's, I like doing it and I think it also gives people the energy to keep that going for the next person. Yeah,

Megan:

I love that. And you're right, it is something that we don't think to do. I don't know why we don't do it. And maybe it is to your point sometimes it takes a while for it to make sense. And I find this with books too. I read a lot of different books and. It takes time where I'm pulling things from different books and it's like, these different pieces come together. And it's same with someone sharing their journey or giving you a piece of advice or asking a question in the moment. It doesn't necessarily mean something or it doesn't seem relevant to your life or the decisions you're trying to make. Quite often it comes around and maybe that's why we don't it feels so long ago that it is a bit awkward to reach out to someone and say, oh, five years ago you said this thing and it's just hitting me now'cause you have to admit the fact that well I didn't listen to you five years ago, but now it is profoundly changed something for me but you're right, it's so powerful to. Do that'cause people don't hear it and they don't. Mm-hmm. We never really have that much opportunity to know what kind of impact we've had on people. So yeah, to get that feedback back is amazing. And so it's not maybe the advice you would give yourself going forward. I think that's just good advice for all of us now of start doing that and yeah, reach out and tell people. I love that.

Yasmin:

I think sometimes we tell other people, but not the person we got the

Megan:

person

Yasmin:

that advice from.

Megan:

Yeah.

Yasmin:

And actually Megan, since we're here, you highly inspired me. When we first connected on your podcast and told me how initially you were a little hesitant and then you, how you fearlessly stepped in and now just started doing it. Actually inspired me to finally start something that I was sitting on and I wasn't sure how to begin. And there's so many resources. Mm-hmm. Let's be honest, we can use chat GPT to help us in ways or cloud ai. I, I really like cloud or different sources or give somebody a phone call at. Somebody entirely different that's already doing it and get some advice and initial tips and tricks. Just to get us started, I think that initial push is so incredibly powerful and you've actually done that for me when I just said your story about how you got here to having this podcast, and it is amazing. I love the questions you're asking. I love the platform and the different stories you're bringing in and you're attracting with this. So thank you for kick starting something with me that you didn't know until I just told you. Right? Yeah. But it's all these interactions I think can contribute to the way we approach or do things or be that final push that you didn't know that where I was at the time that I was sitting on this thing. Yeah. But you still shared your story and we're open and vulnerable to do so I really appreciate you doing that and yeah, thanks for doing that. I'm excited to soon talk about it, but it kicked start something more to come.

Megan:

Thank you. Well. I'm glad for any part I played in that. I can't wait to hear about it. And sounds like you're not ready to talk about it yet, but it does lead into my next question. So feel free to be as vague as you want or deflect to something else. But looking forward to the future, what is your vision or what are you excited about or hopeful for in the future? It could be short term, it could be long term. It could be a bit of both.

Yasmin:

Yeah, I'm super excited about my continued journey at Sunnova, especially now that there's a merger coming up, and with that evolution, new opportunities will come up and I really, really love the role that I found there. It perfectly plays into my natural interest. So I'm excited for continued growth. Right. It's been less than a year.

Megan:

Mm-hmm.

Yasmin:

And, you need a couple of years to learn and grow and to fully contribute you at your highest value that you can to any company that you're in. Always takes time. I'm excited for that. Also, what I was hinting at a little bit, my free time, I tap more into real estate investment and it is a very scary space initially, especially for somebody from Germany where people always save money and we are never buying anything unless we can afford it five times. And there's a very different mentality around investments and how we manage money. That I grew up with and I was able to. Modify that and enhance it in the US and really see how things over here can be structured. Especially when it comes to financials. It's a very different system. Just, the way we're scored. Our credit score rewards entirely opposite behavior. In Germany. It rewards saving and not taking a loan. Mm-hmm. Over here, it almost forces you to take different and multiple ways of credit cards and loans and really rewards that behavior. So it's very different and it's very interesting and critical when you move countries to understand what financial system am I moving to? What does the legal system look like? Yeah. Also, opposite worlds. How does the health system look like? Taxes, the tax code, you have to read it. And there's so many components that, have you modify and enhance how you're living in that particular country. But I'm excited for that journey that I'm taking on the site. I'm currently working on a gut rehab project that's very scary, and there was a house from the early 19 hundreds that's now entirely gutted and it's just bones right now. And, needs a chance, it needs a second chance in life. So I'm currently in the design stage, and that's really something that I also love design. I didn't mention it here just yet, but I also was in car design for a couple of years and it's always one of my passions. I just staged the first house. Just because I wanted to try it out, it came out beautiful. I didn't think I was able to do it. But there's a lot that I would like to explore in the real estate market, side by side with. But payments will always be at my core. And, the focus on that. And I'm excited for the next couple of years and, you know, see where the journey takes us. And it, you're on an interesting journey yourself. I'm excited to see how your podcast will grow and who else will come on here and talk about super exciting stuff that we can all learn. We can learn from each guest that you had on so far. Ultimately you're building that and you're documenting it, right. Typically we have those conversations in private, you're documenting it. That's super exciting. I'm grateful for you having me and reaching out to me and giving me a platform to, share each other's story and experience today.

Megan:

I really. Appreciate you sharing your story. And I agree, that's one of the things I'm hoping from the podcast is people can learn from each other's journeys, right? Everyone's journey is really unique and I think that's what's so exciting about it. There's so much pressure and this feeling of oh, there's a right way to do things, but that's not true, so let's. Explore a little bit more, enjoy it. And there is so many things we can learn from other people's journeys. And even if it's just the freedom to be like maybe I can experiment a bit with something. And just even how you have the side project. I think that's so exciting and I can't wait to, see some pictures of the renovation.'cause I love that kind of stuff too, your career doesn't have to fulfill every need. So payments is your core. But you enjoy design. There's other things you wanna explore and you can kind do those things too. And, we don't have to put ourselves in boxes. So I love that. And yeah, I'm excited to see, where it all goes. That's really cool.

Yasmin:

Send some really current state scary photos over.

Megan:

Amazing.

Yasmin:

It's good. It will be a couple of months and it's about to be really cold where the house is located. But yeah, I'll share the journey with you and maybe one day we can just come back and look at that component and all the learnings. Because that's a brand new world to me, and so scary. And for some reason I like to do things that are scary initially because typically it's the unknown, right? Once we do it, yeah. And then it almost turns fun if you enjoy it. Sometimes it's just not for you, but you tried it and at least then you tackled one of your fears or one of the, doesn't always have to be that dramatic, but it could just be an unknown. Hey, I don't know how that entire industry works, right? Let me tap into it, play around with it, see if it's for me. But worst case, and even then. To your point, I don't think it's a bad thing. It fails. Yeah. So what you tried, right, and out of this will come new learnings and insights and growth. Or maybe you just finding out that wasn't for you and that's okay.

Megan:

Yeah,

Yasmin:

that's totally fine. That's still

Megan:

really important information and That's

Yasmin:

right.

Megan:

You would get skills through that process and even if it's not for you, it's okay, well now I know that you know, I'll go on to the next thing.

Yasmin:

That's right.

Megan:

Yeah.

Yasmin:

To mentally check it off. Done that, tried it. Not for me. Let's go find something that's for me and helps me grow.

Megan:

Exactly. Exactly. Amazing. Thank you Yasmin. Thank you so much for sharing your story and the decisions along the way. I really appreciate it. And yeah, I'm really excited to, see the evolution of this renovation. And I love seeing your career as well in the payment space and as you referred to earlier, we have this lovely international community in this space. And so, it's lovely to see you flourish in that and then in the payment space as a whole. I'm excited for all of that.

Yasmin:

Thank you Megan. Same for you. And I can't wait to further see your podcast grow. So thank you so much for having me. It's truly an honor.

Megan:

Awesome. Thank you.

Yasmin:

Thank you. Bye.

It was so lovely chatting with Yasmin about her career and how she pivoted from tennis. A few things that I'm taking away from our conversation were one, it takes just one person to give you a chance. Like Deutsche Bank giving Yasmin her first job in banking and then just as Yasmin did put in the effort and make the most out of the opportunity, two careers can come from unexpected places. Yasmin's teacher inadvertently put her on her path towards banking and some freelance translation led to a 10 year career at a company and eventually a move to the us. Three, be open to opportunities and try things, but you don't have to stay somewhere that isn't a good fit. As Yasmin said, staying in the wrong place can negatively impact more than your fulfillment at work. Lastly, I love Yasmin's advice for all of us. When someone has had an impact on you, let them know, even if it's years later that their advice or example has resonated with you. Thank you for listening to the unexpected career podcast, please follow, share and rate on your favorite podcast provider. The unexpected career podcast is produced, edited and hosted by me, Megan Dunford. See you next week.

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Megan Dunford

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